From C. S Lewis;
It would be an error to reply that our ancestors were
ignorant and therefore entertained pleasing illusions about nature which the
progress of science has since dispelled. For centuries, during which all men
believed, the nightmare size and emptiness of the universe was already known.
You will read in some books that the men of the Middle Ages thought the Earth
flat and the stars near, but that is a lie. Ptolemy had told them that the
Earth was a mathematical point without size in relation to the distance of the
fixed stars—a distance which one mediæval popular text estimates as
a hundred and seventeen million miles. And in times yet
earlier, even from the beginnings, men must have got the same sense of hostile
immensity from a more obvious source. To prehistoric man the neighbouring
forest must have been infinite enough, and the utterly alien and infest which
we have to fetch from the thought of cosmic rays and cooling suns, came
snuffing and howling nightly to his very doors. Certainly at all periods the
pain and waste of human life was equally obvious. Our own religion begins among
the Jews, a people squeezed between great warlike empires, continually defeated
and led captive, familiar as Poland or Armenia with the tragic story of the conquered.
It is mere nonsense to put pain among the discoveries of science. Lay down this
book and reflect for five minutes on the fact that all the great religions were
first preached, and long practised, in a world without chloroform.
12 comments:
"How did the argument from evil get to be strong?"
What does the rest of the text in the post have to do with the title?
I expected, with that title, to read some discussion of an all good, all powerful, all everything sort of god, and how that could logically be the case given our perception of evil in the world.
Instead, it seems like just some more amorphous ruminations by Lewis, including an ignoring of ancient cosmologies as somehow misrepresented in a general "lie".
"the nightmare size and emptiness of the universe"
Nightmare? Does the size of the universe give you nightmares? Does the universe frighten you? Apparently Lewis was somehow afraid of the universe and projected his own fear onto mankind as a whole, how very bizarre.
It is an arguments against some forms of theism. Most of the pre-modern theistic concepts are compatible with the existence of evil in the world.
One modern concept that has no problem with the problem of evil is deism. Another would be atheism.
Well, yes, about the problem of evil, generally.
But what does the problem of evil have to do with the posted text?
I cannot recall a previous instance where the title of the post was so disconnected from the content of the post.
It would be like having a title "Why is the Kalam Cosmological Argument So Weak?"
Then in the body of the post mention nothing about the origin of the universe, time, infinity, or any such subjects. Instead, just discuss your favorite recipes for brownies and cookies.
From C. S Lewis;
"It would be an error to reply that our ancestors were ignorant and therefore entertained pleasing illusions about nature which the progress of science has since dispelled."
Honestly Victor, I just don't see what you find to be so compelling about Lewis.
Of course our ancestors were ignorant.
Of course they therefore had illusions about nature.
Of course the progress of science has dispelled such illusions.
Ignorant simply means to lack knowledge. Our ancestors did not know about the chemical elements, what makes the wind blow, what makes the sun shine, microscopic life, and on and on and on.
Our ancestors imagined all sorts of illusions about nature, that there were four elements, that disease was caused by demonic possession, and that god created the universe in 6 days some 6000 years ago.
Science has dispelled those and many other such illusions.
What possible appeal do you find in such patently erroneous writings by Lewis?
"It is mere nonsense to put pain among the discoveries of science."
This has to be one of the more bizarre strawmen from Lewis. What is he even talking about?
I have never in my life heard anybody even suggest that pain was discovered by science.
It is mere writing of fiction by Lewis to suggest that somehow somebody thinks pain was discovered by science, but then, Lewis is a writer of fiction, even when he makes some attempt at more serious commentary, it seems all he ever writes is fiction.
Don't forget everyone, SP believes that the experience of pain is grounded in a hallucination
Well, SteveK, maybe you can explain to us all what the rest of the text of the OP has to do with the title of the OP?
The experience of pain is related to the OP because pain is one way that we come to understand evil.
So, Lewis is arguing that the problem of evil is a strong argument against an all powerful and all good god because of how terrifying the universe is and how painful and wasteful life has always been. The Jews were persecuted and wolves come to your very door and life is generally a miserable and frightening and painful experience so therefore don't believe people who tell you there is and all good and all powerful god.
The OP is a section from Lewis's The Problem of Pain
https://matiane.wordpress.com/2021/06/13/problem-of-pain-by-c-s-lewis/#:~:text=It%20would%20be%20an%20error,the%20universe%20was%20already%20known.
The introduction and first paragraph provide the context.
The title of the OP conflates pain with evil.
They’re both hallucinations so what does it matter?
It had already occurred to me to wonder, "How did the argument from evil/argument from suffering get to be fashionable?" The argument seems to be esteemed as a strong argument in that portion of the population of the modern world that is Western or under Western hegemony while being a disregarded nothing of a weak argument in a) the larger part of the modern world's population and b) all populations of the pre-Modern world.
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