tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post8112993248270641281..comments2024-03-28T12:34:14.649-07:00Comments on dangerous idea: The Magician's TwinVictor Repperthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10962948073162156902noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-34619837152166053582012-09-20T02:08:39.710-07:002012-09-20T02:08:39.710-07:00Are You Living In a Computer Simulation?
I think ...<i>Are You Living In a Computer Simulation?</i><br /><br />I think I lost brain cells by skimming that article.rank sophisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01644531454383207175noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-80954693870814352012012-09-19T18:05:37.559-07:002012-09-19T18:05:37.559-07:00Call you Mr Anderson in a computer simulated unive...Call you Mr Anderson in a computer simulated universe? No. Your name would be:<br />01011000110. 10010101010001111001010111000101010101000110001011001011100010. ;o)Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-88165626789985715662012-09-19T12:07:50.007-07:002012-09-19T12:07:50.007-07:00If we are in a computer simulation then you guys c...If we are in a computer simulation then you guys can call me Mr. Anderson.Anthony Fleminghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11726267495699324589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-63520664786912386922012-09-19T12:06:25.996-07:002012-09-19T12:06:25.996-07:00Victor, I think it is good that you contributed to...Victor, I think it is good that you contributed to the book. It's good to get the argument out there and let people decide for themselves. I am not very familiar with the discovery institute either, but I think the arguments and positions need to be evaluated on their own, to stand or fall.<br /><br />We want more minds to access the AFR and provide further insight and criticism! So, thank you for your contribution.Anthony Fleminghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11726267495699324589noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-22697302052677654212012-09-19T09:17:58.223-07:002012-09-19T09:17:58.223-07:00Are You Living In a Computer Simulation?<a href="http://www.simulation-argument.com/simulation.html" rel="nofollow">Are You Living In a Computer Simulation?</a>Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07342391408412861663noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-28177942418646245052012-09-19T05:59:00.043-07:002012-09-19T05:59:00.043-07:00It also makes me think of Mormonism, where they th...It also makes me think of Mormonism, where they think that men (not women!) will eventually become gods themselves and create their own universes (and that our God was also once a man who subsequently graduated into goodhood). In fact, now that I consider it, it's strongly reminiscent of the currently popular "multiverse" theory (in which our universe is the offspring of a previous one, which itself came out of a yet previous universe, <i>ad infinitum</i>.) <br /><br />Just goes to show you - there are no new ideas!B. Prokophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10548980245078214688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-87129644275315598012012-09-19T04:50:41.045-07:002012-09-19T04:50:41.045-07:00Bob,
I don't doubt it - it's actually sem...Bob,<br /><br />I don't doubt it - it's actually semi-popular in some "atheist" circles.<br /><br />I think anyone who subscribes to that belief would best be described as a pagan theist. As you said, "A lot like you or me", which would be rather like Zeus or Thor.Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-79487274441172722262012-09-19T04:10:35.464-07:002012-09-19T04:10:35.464-07:00No, because he (his name's Phil) thinks that w...No, because he (his name's Phil) thinks that whoever made this simulation is just someone like you or me.<br /><br />I must admit I can't take the notion the least bit seriously. Sounds dangerously close to solipsism to me.<br />B. Prokophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10548980245078214688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-88409713247065135952012-09-18T23:09:34.912-07:002012-09-18T23:09:34.912-07:00Bob
"There is a fellow member of my astronomy...Bob<br /><i>"There is a fellow member of my astronomy club who is quite serious in his belief that our universe is a computer simulation created by someone in another reality. He's not kidding."</i><br /><br />Sounds like a variation of the traditional god theme to me, would you say?<br /><br />Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-60708711561835636812012-09-18T19:46:56.724-07:002012-09-18T19:46:56.724-07:00There is a fellow member of my astronomy club who ...There is a fellow member of my astronomy club who is quite serious in his belief that our universe is a computer simulation created by someone in another reality. He's not kidding.B. Prokophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10548980245078214688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-80601843357195304642012-09-18T19:32:56.495-07:002012-09-18T19:32:56.495-07:00Bob,
As for what the "major proponents"...Bob,<br /><br /><i>As for what the "major proponents" of ID have to say, I must confess I've never read any of their work. So perhaps I'm misusing the term, or else using it very idiosyncratically.</i><br /><br />Fair enough. If you actually look at what they themselves say, it's ridiculously tame. They don't even pretend you can infer from an instance of ID to God scientifically, and explicitly say such inferences are philosophical or otherwise, and not science.<br /><br />I still think they're incorrect on certain levels, but the amount of misrepresentation that goes on when it comes to stating what ID proponents claim is stunning.<br /><br />I agree with your other statements.Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-31573209868415313902012-09-18T19:23:57.622-07:002012-09-18T19:23:57.622-07:00I seriously answer that when I observe the univers...I seriously answer that when I observe the universe, it appears designed to me. That is in no way whatsoever a scientific statement, It is a matter of perception. I see no signs of randomness or purposlessness. I see instead incredible fine tuning and an utterly amazing interconnectedness. I find the differing perspectives resultant from varying scales (from the quantum level to the other extreme of taking in all the galaxies at once) to be in perfect harmony. I say to myself, "This doesn't happen by itself! No way."<br /><br />As for what the "major proponents" of ID have to say, I must confess I've never read any of their work. So perhaps I'm misusing the term, or else using it very idiosyncratically.B. Prokophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10548980245078214688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-38198113330984949702012-09-18T17:59:54.084-07:002012-09-18T17:59:54.084-07:00Bob,
I ask this seriously. Would you state what I...Bob,<br /><br />I ask this seriously. Would you state what ID, as considered by its major proponents, actually claims?Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-91152913840887201972012-09-18T17:17:54.238-07:002012-09-18T17:17:54.238-07:00I think the very useful concept of Intelligent Des...I think the very useful concept of Intelligent Design has been horribly misused and subsequently maligned by people on both sides of the debate of late. Personally, I am a big believer in ID. <b>But</b>... Just as I would never dream of using the Doctrine of the Trinity in an explanation of planetary formation, I think it completely inappropriate to use what is essentially the philosophical concept of ID in a physical sciences context. ID stands in the same relation to the science of biology that Social Darwinism does. Both ideas are ways to view and interpret the data through one's personal philosophical lens.<br /><br />(Please note that I very carefully used the term "Social Darwinism" and not "evolution" in the above paragraph.)B. Prokophttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10548980245078214688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-80500268576337565782012-09-18T15:32:09.220-07:002012-09-18T15:32:09.220-07:00From the little I've read by DI guys commentin...From the little I've read by DI guys commenting on Lewis, they think he would support ID wholeheartedly. I doubt this would be the case, since Lewis saw scientific conclusions as being tentative in nature and not the sort of thing one should base their faith upon. Let's hope their book on Lewis is more faithful to him than what they have to say online.Bilbohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06231440026059820600noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-45102133468084072692012-09-18T11:36:08.169-07:002012-09-18T11:36:08.169-07:00Victor,
The shadow all the Young Earth Creationis...Victor,<br /><br /><i>The shadow all the Young Earth Creationists who have fought against the teaching of evolution in schools hangs over anyone who challenges any aspect of Darwinian theory.</i><br /><br />Again, as Fodor, Nagel and others have discovered. I think the reaction Fodor and Nagel received is pretty instructive, since in those cases you have two atheists who merely questioned, not even common descent or evolutionary theory generally, but Darwinism/Neo-Darwinism specifically. The response would best be described as a freakout.<br /><br />Not to mention the responses to Behe, who gets painted as some kind of stealth-YEC radical, when in reality his criticisms and inferences are absurdly tame.Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-1801248729317931362012-09-18T09:09:45.461-07:002012-09-18T09:09:45.461-07:00"Even the"? So Templeton is trustworthy ...<i>"Even the"? So Templeton is trustworthy when they blast the DI, but not otherwise? ;) Not to mention the wikipedia's the last place to look for for accurate ID/DI representation.</i><br /><br />The Templeton Foundation isn't untrustworthy, but they do tend to fund projects that lean a certain way. I actually appreciate all of the funding they give philosophers. Matt DeStefanohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14408364244593519914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-20793018887324199892012-09-18T05:32:43.734-07:002012-09-18T05:32:43.734-07:00Victor
"The shadow all the Young Earth Creat...Victor<br /> "The shadow all the Young Earth Creationists who have fought against the teaching of evolution in schools hangs over anyone who challenges any aspect of Darwinian theory."<br /><br />What you have characterized as 'shadow' is simply the process of substantively demonstrating that ID, along with its concept of 'irreducible complexity,' as bona fide science, just as any other scientific proposition would need to do. Science research in the State legislature or science research in the school boardroom, the preferred model practiced by the Discovery Institute as set down in its Wedge strategy document, is simply not kosher science as that done in a loboratory or in the field.<br />Just not kosker.Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-76108524471346886822012-09-18T05:04:17.395-07:002012-09-18T05:04:17.395-07:00Thanks crude. I'll take your advice on board....Thanks crude. I'll take your advice on board.Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-12901820261128903252012-09-18T04:14:51.292-07:002012-09-18T04:14:51.292-07:00I went in with a spoiler attitude. Didn't feel...<i>I went in with a spoiler attitude. Didn't feel right.</i><br /><br />You went in with the same exact attitude you enter into every conversation with. And as predicted, you were blown off as a rube.<br /><br />Deservedly.<br /><br /><i>and now that I have broken the ice, will regularly comment over there if and when I have something to contribute</i><br /><br />Bad news: the only way you'll shake the 'Linton is a complete rube' badge you earned is by not just googling and copy/pasting, but comprehending and having insightful commentary. Frankly, you don't have what it takes. Let's face it: you don't show up in comboxes to learn and understand anything, much less discuss topics intelligently. That shit's <b>difficult</b>, what with the 'reading and understanding' part. So you went for plan B: trying to play cheerleader for someone who does comprehend and discuss, but they wanted no part of it. So, you're cashed.<br /><br />But hey, let me help you out.<br /><br />Matt DeStefano, do you need a <a href="http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/2012-09-11/" rel="nofollow">remora</a>? Because Linton needs a new host.Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-78074817946595694032012-09-18T03:36:06.968-07:002012-09-18T03:36:06.968-07:00Crude
I went in with a spoiler attitude. Didn'...Crude<br />I went in with a spoiler attitude. Didn't feel right.<br />Feser is a smart bloke, and now that I have broken the ice, will regularly comment over there if and when I have something to contribute. :o)<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-87360825613283278652012-09-18T03:12:21.005-07:002012-09-18T03:12:21.005-07:00Linton,
Done with Feser's already? I'm su...Linton,<br /><br />Done with Feser's already? I'm sure everyone recognized your brilliance, including the atheists, and it absolutely wasn't the case that they all thought you were a complete twit. ;)Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-60478083061141126392012-09-18T02:52:52.382-07:002012-09-18T02:52:52.382-07:00Victor,
Are you happy to be associated with the Di...Victor,<br />Are you happy to be associated with the Discovery Institute or are you just placing an each-way bet in the manner of investing in a hedge fund?<br />Papalintonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03818630173726146048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-57121523178071184982012-09-18T00:20:13.434-07:002012-09-18T00:20:13.434-07:00I'm embarrassed for you.
Look, everyone. BI i...<i>I'm embarrassed for you.</i><br /><br />Look, everyone. <i>BI</i> is embarrassed for someone. You know it must be bad.<br /><br />(No offense, Victor. I'm not particularly familiar with the Discovery Institute either way.)rank sophisthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01644531454383207175noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-20341214708185175622012-09-18T00:10:03.127-07:002012-09-18T00:10:03.127-07:00The DI is so bad that even the Templeton Foundatio...<i>The DI is so bad that even the Templeton Foundation has called out their quackery:</i><br /><br />"Even the"? So Templeton is trustworthy when they blast the DI, but not otherwise? ;) Not to mention the wikipedia's the last place to look for for accurate ID/DI representation.<br /><br />The DI is in better shape than the NCSE. I loved how they got off to the start of this year, with that whole 'hiring a liar and a cheat' bit. And then opposing the TN law in utterly ludicrous grounds.Crudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04178390947423928444noreply@blogger.com