tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post6585182354041756418..comments2024-03-18T11:10:18.708-07:00Comments on dangerous idea: I once argued against open borders. I got this rebuttal Victor Repperthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10962948073162156902noreply@blogger.comBlogger206125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-3135757451997959632018-07-01T07:19:21.483-07:002018-07-01T07:19:21.483-07:00Agreed.
Both sides should stop hating and justify...Agreed.<br /><br />Both sides should stop hating and justifying hate.<br />It's only when we actually listen to each other and care about each other that we can come together to solve problems together.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-34200608338230768102018-06-30T22:41:22.051-07:002018-06-30T22:41:22.051-07:00"Seems that Leftists love to hate."
I d..."Seems that Leftists love to hate."<br /><br />I don't think anyone has cornered the market there.Kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02593005679430527458noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-52441284585780540202018-06-30T22:11:16.594-07:002018-06-30T22:11:16.594-07:00Hmmm.
Seems that Leftists love to hate.
What'...Hmmm.<br /><br />Seems that Leftists love to hate.<br />What's up with that?bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-20371607219797952772018-06-30T22:07:30.112-07:002018-06-30T22:07:30.112-07:00Yes, hate is part of life
I hate evil. Not people...Yes, hate is part of life<br /><br />I hate evil. Not people.<br />I am a Christian. Free yourself from hating people.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-26202784669444927992018-06-30T22:07:18.258-07:002018-06-30T22:07:18.258-07:00Thanks, nice talking to you!Thanks, nice talking to you!World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-75979248823649430382018-06-30T22:05:33.537-07:002018-06-30T22:05:33.537-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-4745397258146779322018-06-30T21:54:52.285-07:002018-06-30T21:54:52.285-07:00Oh come on, you're just trolling now!
Yes, hat...Oh come on, you're just trolling now!<br />Yes, hate is part of life... we should try to discourage hate, we should promote love. But we don't love everyone, and hopefully we get to hate as few as possible. The problem is that people like you are clearly trying to promote the idea that some people are that bad that they again and again promote hate. They're hateful people. <br /><br />How is that not hate itself? <br /><br />You need to really dislike a lot of individuals to think that the Left, or the Liberals, or whoever the heck it is you're talking about, promotes hate over violence. That's the problem with the video you posted, or the individuals that share that narrative. You're trying really hard to paint others as hateful. That is hateful...<br /><br />World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-27590308879029413762018-06-30T21:48:00.381-07:002018-06-30T21:48:00.381-07:00Got it.
You are OK with people hating people.Got it.<br /><br />You are OK with people hating people.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-16354930913215268662018-06-30T21:41:53.922-07:002018-06-30T21:41:53.922-07:00And yes, hate against world leaders is completely ...And yes, hate against world leaders is completely fine. It's what people do about it that matters. What do they hate? Why? What actions do they take?World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-11240445426101392622018-06-30T21:40:26.195-07:002018-06-30T21:40:26.195-07:00Criticizing one person doesn't mean promoting ...Criticizing one person doesn't mean promoting hate over love. Even hating one person doesn't mean promoting hate over love overall. If someone sees someone as hateful, and they hate them for that, it's consistent with wanting to promote love over hate.World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-27278956107763603362018-06-30T21:33:26.706-07:002018-06-30T21:33:26.706-07:00Huh?
Hate against a world leader is OK?Huh?<br />Hate against a world leader is OK?bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-28942289206222552852018-06-30T21:19:59.807-07:002018-06-30T21:19:59.807-07:00(Flip that...)(Flip that...)World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-10179236298765097242018-06-30T21:18:45.708-07:002018-06-30T21:18:45.708-07:00How is that promoting love over hate?How is that promoting love over hate?World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-77023995170059754592018-06-30T20:37:22.925-07:002018-06-30T20:37:22.925-07:00Cool! When you run into specific people explicitly...<b>Cool! When you run into specific people explicitly against that, let me know.</b><br /><br />How about when I spot someone promoting hate against a world leader? Because, let me think for a bit, but I could come up with some names.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-2047674176168921372018-06-30T20:25:41.377-07:002018-06-30T20:25:41.377-07:00-- All I've claimed is that it exists and prom...-- All I've claimed is that it exists and promotes love over hate. <br /><br />Cool! When you run into specific people explicitly against that, let me know.World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-62021771517823172732018-06-30T20:21:56.180-07:002018-06-30T20:21:56.180-07:00@Hugo,
I get it you disagree with him.
I was refe...@Hugo,<br /><br />I get it you disagree with him.<br />I was referring to part of your quote where you said you didn't believe this was happening that I found interesting. Wondering if you thought it was fake news.<br /><br /><b>So what? </b><br />So it means some people are turned off by the direction the Democratic party is going and are leaving. I linked an earlier article from a liberal from a liberal magazine complaining about the direction of the Democratic party wrt immigration so it seems to me that there could be some "there" there. Maybe not. But I do hope people avoid hate and violence.<br /><br />You're right that a subject can't be banned. Individuals can be banned. I expect that to happen.<br /><br /><b>But let's also focus on facts rather than hearsay.</b><br /><br />Not sure what you mean. #WalkAway is hearsay? All I've claimed is that it exists and promotes love over hate.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-65674935064008967502018-06-30T18:56:57.787-07:002018-06-30T18:56:57.787-07:00@bmiller
Didn't you read my commentary on the...@bmiller<br /><br />Didn't you read my commentary on the video? I think it's pretty clear what I think of him, but to summarize:<br /><br />It doesn't make sense to me to talk about " the guy used to be liberal and left". Leave what? His "tribe" as he said? But then he's just talking about groups of people he used to like and now doesn't like. So what? That doesn't tell us anything about his positions. He actually implies that his views have not changed much, given that he "joined" Liberals (again, whatever that means...) for the same reason that he left. So he is ALL about the group, ALL about the tribe, and NOT about ideas, facts, reasoning.<br /><br />Regarding the hashtag, it's just that, a hashtag... what else can you infer from it? You said yourself that you don't know how popular it is, just that it's "trending". I tried to find some information and it doesn't look very popular actually. Most people who retweet it appear to be Trump supporters already, or I cannot tell. I saw literally 1 out of maybe 50 who said he used to vote Democrat all his life and will now vote Republicans because... of what they did to Bernie. So, not much of a Trump fan per se. So, it doesn't really tell us anything about how many people support that idea of switching side. And what would they do differently exactly? Is it just about not voting for Democrats this fall for example? Well, we have polls for that and then actual elections, so we'll see...<br /><br />Finally, why would it get banned? Because you see some sort of anti-Right conspiracies from Twitter? I know they did stupid things in the past like banning individuals for no good reason at all. But banning a hashtag? What does that even mean? And something as benign at that... come on.<br /><br />Finally, great, let's focus on love rather than hate. <br />But let's also focus on facts rather than hearsay.World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-41867701246446101752018-06-30T18:55:58.794-07:002018-06-30T18:55:58.794-07:00Chad: "Legion, in that post, I didn't me...Chad: "Legion, in that post, I didn't mention your position, I only mentioned that you seemed not to know some very basic facts about the case. I could be accussed of misrepresenting your motives, but not your position. But you'll whine about this in lieu of a substantial response no matter what I say, so keep going. Maybe you'll fool somebody."<br /><br /><br />I said you misrepresented me. Misrepresenting anything about me is misrepresenting me. It's pretty easy to demonstrate, though ironically you have pre-misrepresented my response as whining and unsubstantial. <br /><br />You said: "You guys speak as if immigration is a very high priority for you, yet you remain remarkably uninformed about basic facts about the biggest immigration story in 20 years."<br /><br />I have never voted for a candidate based on their immigration policy. This is because immigration is a not a "very high priority" for me. Simply participating in a discussion and having an opinion is not indicative of something being a "very high priority", so the most likely explanation for being "remarkably uninformed about basic facts about the biggest immigration story in 20 years" is that I had not previously been closely following it. In fact I often participate in discussions of which I am not an "expert" because it's a relatively fast way to be exposed to things I didn't know. But no, you attempt to paint a different picture. I wonder why.<br /><br />You said: "I can't explain that except to assume you've made the decision, perhaps subconsciously (or overtly, in SteveK's case) to look the other way where cruelty to immigrants is concerned, so long as you get the end result you want."<br /><br />In this thread, I have said "cruelty to immigrants" is acceptable or justifiable exactly zero times. In this thread, I have condemned the separation of families at least a dozen times. When I say "X" twelve times and I say "Y" zero times, and you "assume" that my position is "Y", then one might rightly say that you are misrepresenting me. You even invoke "subconsciously", which can be easily asserted but not truly refuted. Well played. <br /><br />It's not unusual behavior on your part in this thread. Ignoring my repeated condemnations of the separation of families. Calling a mistake an "<b>OUTRIGHT LIE</b>". Saying I only care about suffering if those affected are on "my side". Lumping me in with what SteveK said (who has expressed a much more hardline position than I) and then claiming I tolerated or justified separating families, which is the exact opposite of what I said. Misrepresentation.<br /><br />I may make mistakes, poorly phrase things, or not know everything (gasp), but I have been honest in admitting when I made a mistake and even acknowledged unnoticed hypocrisy on my part, something that I have seen online from other people maybe once. Your conduct has been quite revealing, as well, and I'm having trouble dismissing it as mistakes, wording, or ignorance.<br />Kevinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02593005679430527458noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-6627209264728439532018-06-30T17:17:49.826-07:002018-06-30T17:17:49.826-07:00@Hugo,
Both in the sense that I don't believe...@Hugo,<br /><br /><b>Both in the sense that I don't believe this is happening, and if it does, these individuals are grossly mistaken. </b><br /><br />So you don't believe the guy used to be liberal and left for the reasons he said. Interesting. Did you visit the #Walkaway twitter site too?<br /><br />Honestly I don't know the extent of this sentiment, but I heard it was trending. I suspect it will get banned on Twitter soon.<br />But I do like the message of love rather than hate.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-80281607234190727382018-06-30T15:55:19.436-07:002018-06-30T15:55:19.436-07:00'...separating groups into identity.' (aro...'...separating groups into identity.' (around the 4-min mark)<br />I stopped longer here because the image shown was interesting. It's a list of privilege in order. It looked like satire to me, or some crazy Leftists. Google revealed it's probably the latter but it's hard to tell. There is almost no mention of such list and it's just on some random forum post, one as old as 2013. Most are actually reposts to laugh at that list. Yet that dude in the video uses that to represent the Democratic party!? Come on... talk about misrepresentation. He's such a hypocrite after stating that he cares about facts and good reporting.<br /><br />I will finish the last 2 minutes but I won't bother commenting in that much details because he lost me already. Let's see:<br />- Complains about victimhood complex. Ya, it happens, but he's generalizing.<br />- But he equates that with lying? That makes no sense.<br />- The MSM bombard minorities with false stores. He's falling into conspiracy theories now.<br />- He finishes with listing his values, great, but he's just lumping an entire party (and all of the Left?) as if they all oppose his values. That's useless rhetoric.<br /><br />That was so underwhelming bmiller.<br />World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-25641418376962175622018-06-30T15:54:57.830-07:002018-06-30T15:54:57.830-07:00@bmiller, I really like what you said here:
"...@bmiller, I really like what you said here:<br />"I'm for love, rational discourse and against hate. I'd like for Americans to have rational discussions to solve our problems, and maybe sometimes we can't convince the other side we're right and they're wrong...that's OK. It doesn't mean they are demon possessed."<br /><br />But I think that this is absurd:<br />"...people are leaving the Democratic party because they think the party is only promoting hate, violence and intolerance."<br />Both in the sense that I don't believe this is happening, and if it does, these individuals are grossly mistaken. But I could be wrong, so I will take a few minutes to watch that 6-min video; I will paraphrase what I hear and comment:<br /><br />'I used to be a Liberal'<br />Will he explain what that meant and how it could change so quickly?<br /><br />'...because I thought I had found a tribe I can agree with'<br />Well that's a horrible start. If one says they are a Liberal because they fit a tribe, it means they are playing a form of identity politics where they accept ideas because of the people, instead of focusing on ideas and discussing them with people.<br /><br />'I reject racism, marginalization because of a-b-c-d..., reject authoritarians who prevent free speech, reject junk science/superstition, reject hate'<br />Ok, obvious<br /><br />'That's why I became a Liberal'<br />Absurd; not only Liberals agree with all that, and some Liberals accept a lot of junk science for example.<br /><br />'And same reason I am walking away'<br />Just as absurd.<br /><br />'Watched Left fall into [list of horrible things for a good 1 minute]'<br />There lots of people who do lots of stupid things; that's not a reason to change your positions on anything. He is clearly conflating groups and ideas, confirming why the first few seconds of the video seemed so off.<br /><br />'They use labels to shame us'<br />Yes they do, and that's what THIS guys is doing by explaining what 'The Left' or 'Liberals' are. Doesn't he see the irony? Don't you see the irony bmiller?<br /><br />'They will come for me. And then they'll come for you'<br />Geez... calm down buddy. Again, there are bad cases that happen all the time. Let's not ignore them, but anecdotes are easy to find, trends are not. Still waiting on something substantial and I am halfway through now.<br /><br />'Worst of all, the party and MSM, embraced a cult ideology. I used to love them but they join the extreme Left. They think they know what the solutions are. The Left has decided...'<br />Again, he complained about labels and now is lumping giant groups of people together and labelling them as some sort of monolith of insanity. Now I will hit play again, and I know what's coming, he's going to mention the worst examples of policies that 'some' on the Left approve of. But he starts with 'The Left decided' as if he could read everybody's mind. Let's see...<br /><br />'The Left has decided that the solution is more racism. The Left believes that attacking, insulting and demonizing one group of people, elevates another.'<br />Hum... that's what he's been doing for 3min 30sec now! He attacks, insults and demonize one giant group of people in order to elevate what is now his new group!<br /><br />'The Left believes there is no boundary when telling lies, omitting the truth, or misreprenting facts, their ends justifies their means, only their point of view matter, they want to ban debates...'<br />More of the same generalization...<br /><br />'The Democratic party has adopted...'<br />Ok, so now it's just the Democrats specifically from this point? Just politicians or anyone who voted/endorsed them? We'll see...<br /><br />'...adpoted a deleterious belief system without skepticism.'<br />Oh so he can read people's minds too? What else do they believe?<br />World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-5431149231503178572018-06-30T15:13:40.670-07:002018-06-30T15:13:40.670-07:00Please Starhopper, take a deep breath.
I hadn'...Please Starhopper, take a deep breath.<br /><br />I hadn't seen Hugo's video till sometime after he posted it so I don't know what drivel you think I believe or don't. I think I only watched a minute or 2.<br /><br /><a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Pjs7uoOkag" rel="nofollow">This gay person</a> started the twitter hashtag and it is trending. The reason I brought it up was to highlight that people are leaving the Democratic party because <b>they</b> think the party is only promoting hate, violence and intolerance. If people keep leaving the Democratic party, they will lose elections. I think Republicans would like that. I don't think you would. What are you going to do about it?<br /><br />Now it doesn't matter if <b>you</b> think that isn't true when others do.<br /><br />I'm for love, rational discourse and against hate. I'd like for Americans to have rational discussions to solve our problems, and maybe sometimes we can't convince the other side we're right and they're wrong...that's OK. It doesn't mean they are demon possessed.<br /><br />I don't think anyone on this thread has made an attempt to have a rational discussion on immigration. I have seen a lot of emotional outrage.bmillerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05855545675821692382noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-11225639669395353832018-06-30T14:42:41.424-07:002018-06-30T14:42:41.424-07:00"Every second"?
You watched a 16 minut..."Every second"? <br /><br />You watched a 16 minute video in the 9 minutes since Hugo posted the link?SteveKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00497892283006396471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-83030397281329650882018-06-30T14:28:50.762-07:002018-06-30T14:28:50.762-07:00Holy Cow, bmiller. I just watched that video that ...Holy Cow, bmiller. I just watched that video that Hugo linked to. Do you actually not see the insanity that fills every second of that weird performance? If that's what you consider rational discourse, well... I'm speechless. There is truly no hope for our country if 30% (and that's all you are) actually believe such drivel.Starhopperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18350334327301656588noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-10584495.post-58323849988374411782018-06-30T14:19:17.358-07:002018-06-30T14:19:17.358-07:00Actually, I googled #Walkaway to see if that's...Actually, I googled #Walkaway to see if that's a thing, so I think I know what you were referring to... I watched the first 6 minutes of that video for instance:<br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEeiYQW_yFU<br />So empty, meaningless, out of touch, unintelligent...World of Factshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11066732051794158264noreply@blogger.com